We were talking in the last post about socialism…
I just saw this and couldn’t find a way to get it into that post, so I’ve made a separate one.
There are, of course, some charities in Germany, as this page lays out. But I think I see what this guy is saying.
Successive governments in the UK have felt it politic to get involved in wars, sometimes to show off their power, and back in the 80s, to gain credence with the public. Sometimes, of course, it was all to keep the man in the big White House happy and ensure that there would be an appearance in the grounds of that house with the big white (or orange) chief, or in the case of Blair, a Congressional Medal.
So we spend a ridiculous amount of money on wars… Killing people costs money. And our taxes pay for this notion of importance that it gives the UK leaders. Winston the warrior for lesser prime ministers like Thatcher and Blair.
But when the troops come home, wounded, physically or mentally, who is it that looks after them?
Well, it’s not the state. They get the same treatment as anyone else, do our brave boys… and a miserable pittance that is.
And the public is guilted into buying poppies or giving to ex-soldiers as they sit on the street with begging bowls because work is out of the question if you have a severe physical disability, or if you are constantly reseeing your best buddy’s head being blown off.
Here, our NHS is under extreme pressure at the moment, as are health services all over the world. But I wonder how many countries are having to organise fundraisers to subsidise their hospitals.
I take my hat off to Captain Tom Moore, a 99-year-old WWII veteran who is walking up and down his garden to raise money for the NHS, but he shouldn’t have felt obliged to do it because the government was underfunding such a vital service.
I think that funding these things properly is what socialism is about. Not everyone will agree with my definition, but that seems to me to be how it works in the Nordic nations.
**********
Anyway, I’ll cheer you up with this gem…
***********
MUNGUIN'S NEW REPUBLIC 
Charity is only a failure of society when it’s needed for the major stuff. Cancer Research, Heart Surgery, anything medical in fact, along with homelessness, disability etc, etc, etc.. I don’t grudge cats or donkeys being cared for and that’s the stuff that in an ideal world charities should be for. The marginal, the whimsical, the tear jerking. The trouble is that there’s too much suffering in the world, too much deserving stuff so where do you draw the line? Fresh water for African kids, simple eye surgery to prevent blindness. Where does it begin because it never ends? As relatively rich well off people in world terms we’re dragged from one good cause to the next, forever tempted and lured by the (paid) marketing people into parting with our hard earned to support this or that worthy cause. It’s a lovely position to be in, giver rather than recipient but woe betide you if you do register with them because you’ll be in their cross hairs and hounded forever with increasingly tear jerking, toe curling tales to make you part with even more. Some years ago, in conversation with the head of fund raising for a major Vol Org I worked for, she told me that when the writing of regular donators started to get a bit shoogly they would then send letters asking if they would like to leave the organisation a legacy as part of their will. The place I ran at the time had about a quarter of a mil of legacies sitting in its coffers to be spent as per strict guidelines. These were so strict that the money was all but unusable by us but was nevertheless kept in the ‘coffers’ for whatever. We run simultaneously with severe staff shortage and shedloads of cash we couldn’t use to get more while the Chief Exec zipped about in a fancy car.
Charity is an industry that provides jobs, not only for basic workers and their managers but in many cases big fat pay cheques for Chief Execs, Directors and such who, in my experience, strutted aboot having their underlings run at their arses thinking they were Erchie. I have never before or since, encountered such a bunch of pompous, over blown, egotistical chancers as I did when working for ********* But then that’s just me, I’m sure everybody else really liked them, thought they were great and gave them the adoration they surely deserved. I’m also sure it’s all much tighter nowadays but hey, ho.
Every long and detailed advert you see on the TV has been commissioned and paid for by a charity and it’s the donators cash that’s doing the paying. There’s lots of businesses would love to do TV ads but can’t afford the humongous costs. I’m not saying don’t give to charity, I’m saying be selective because the more something is needed the more it is exploited by the unscrupulous.
That’ll be business as usual then.
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I’ve seen some of the ads they run on daytime TV when I’ve been watching catch ups of Vera or Midsommer Murders.
I guess they are aimed at older people and yes, they are tear jerking and, as you say fantastically expensive.
I also see that many of them have fantastically expensive head quarters in the centre of London. And that their CEOs and directors have enormous salaries.
They say, of course, that running a massive organisation like Save the Children or Oxfam needs top managerial skills and you’re not going to get that for £20,000 pa.
I stopped giving to these big charities.
I do give to local foodbanks, not Trussel Trust, although, I don’t think I should have to. Because there should be a safety net.
There’s some place for charity, maybe because people WANT to do something, but THE BIG SOCIETY showed me that mos of it is about the government doing and spending less on people who need help and persuading suckers to do it for them.
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“Britain” is not a country I want to be any part of any more.
What was I saying? Or rather, what you were saying, Tris. Charitable donations. I used to give to a couple of local charities here in Dundee, but just recently I’ve got my foster sons that I’m helping out – they’re under lockdown too, are not earning anything, and neither is stupid enough to expect any help out of the Kenyan Government. Then there’s the Maasai people I know and care about too … their unenviable situation makes me all the more appreciative of the peace and security I enjoy here in Scotland.
The German attitude toward charity which Henning Wehn outlined reminded me of another feature of life in the German-speaking world. In my time in Vienna, every year a couple of guys in white dungarees and caps (yes, white) would come round with a machine in order to get rid of any soot in the flues – as a public service: these were the municipal chimney sweeps. The purpose of that, obviously, is to reduce the risk to public health and safety of soot fires in chimneys. It reminded me also of a story I heard which involved a house fire affecting an English family living in Germany that was caused by an electrical fault – unusually, they had actually bought the place rather than rent.
The local “expat” British / English community had a whip-round for them, which their German friends and colleagues thought was a totally bizarre idea. Their reasons were as follows:
(a) The electrical fault could have been prevented by carrying out an annual safety check of the electrical installation. This is considered quite normal, I understand, so the German take on it was that the problem was caused by a failure of the people in question to take proper care of their property.
(b) Why did they need help from their friends? Did they not have savings, did they not have insurance? If not, that too was astoundingly careless and improvident of them!
(c) If they didn’t want to look after such things themselves, they should have rented so that the landlord would have been responsible for it. Unless, of course, they themselves had done something unsafe with the electrics.
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Interesting, Ed.
I have an annual check on my gas heating system, which I consider to be my responsibility.
But of course, I have no guarantee that the other people who live in the area do the same thing.
So if they don;t and THEY cause an explosion, I’m out of pocket and out of luck!
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In a rich and civilised country there shouldn’t be such a reliance on charity to support necessary services but unfortunately we live in the low tax, no support economy that is the uk. No point in the rich paying their way. As long as we remain in the uk that will continue. Look at Germany and they are already looking to loosen restrictions but they had a well funded test and trace system
You get what you deserve and they have a tax system that is fair for the rich and the poor. As long as we are governed by Westminster low tax and no care will be the norm
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Yes, and unlike Britain, which did some investigation into the possibility of a pandemic on its way and then ignored it, becasue Brexit was more important, and they had no spare money for people’s health… Germany will have been prepared for this.
But then, they;ve had Angela and we’ve had Maybot and the Nut Cases.
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Totally agree. The UK had sufficient warning with Italy and Spain making the same mistake but Westminster decided to follow there example. Absolutely wrong and Italy said that others shouldn’t follow their example but Westminster didn’t listen. But to do otherwise costs money. Pay low tax rates get poor services. Its a no brainer get away from Westminster and take control of our own country
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Well, we’re getting what England voted for for the last 10 years in however many elections they’ve had.
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Tris
I am sorry but I have a real bee in my bonnet on this. The UK had plenty warning with this and the reaction was woeful. 40 years of right wing ideology and that includes Blair and brown has lef to a health service that is totally underfunded. Therefore the health service cannot react to a emergency like this. We have tory ministers and supporters trying to blame all and sundry but don’t take any of the blame. Can’t see why the media don’t point this out. Of course they have an agenda as well and it’s not to support the less well off
Totally disgusting but I am not surprised
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The media are largely in the pocket of the Tories, Robert.
Not only has the health service been underfunded, but, quite simply because of Brexit, there were, in their eyes, more important things to worry about than the predicted pandemic. There were studies done in 2016 which forewarned of something like this (probably not as bad) happening relatively soon.
But in 2016 they were too busy with Brexit, Cameron going, May coming , then May going and the Cummings taking over…
They are so scared that they won’t get Brexit done that NOTHING else matters.
Some other countries did preparatory stuff.
Britain did not, it seems.
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Absolutely
Britain done nothing and the poor and old pay the dearest price.
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What Karl Marx wrote in the mid 19th century about charities still has a lot of explanatory relevance today.
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Can you enlighten the less well read of us (me) what that was, Alasdair? Munguin says to go do research. He’s not explaining it.
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Unfortunately, a few years ago, when my wife decided we would do a major redecoration*. I gave away most of the political texts I accumulated during my teens and twenties, but the gist of things stayed in my memory. Broadly, what he was saying chimes with what the German politican was saying at the start of you piece. and what you said about your experience with the Trussel Trust.
* I had decided to paint the front door and, by the end of the month, we had a new kitchen, all of the rooms were painted, new carpets laid, new curtains hung, every cupboard cleaned out and that is when my politics library was donated to Shelter.
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LOL … it’s addictive, particularly if YOU’RE not the one doing it.
The same thing happens with Munguin.
Got this general meaning Alasdair.
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Here is something gleaned from Google.
THE THIRD Thesis entails, or leads right into, rejection of the whole humanitarian-philanthropic attitude toward the masses of people, which was typical not only of Owen and the utopians, but also of all the other pre-Marxian socialists to one degree or another. There are many reasons why the masses need protection from their friends, “but the greatest of these is charity.” In the long run, a people can be held in subjection most effectively not by brute force but by gutting them of the capacity to fight for themselves.
St. Peter explained it long ago: “For charity shall cover the multitude of sins.” It was explained also in Deuteronomy: “For the poor shall never cease out of the land: therefore I command thee, saying, Thou shalt open thine hand wide unto thy brother, to thy poor, and thy needy, in thy land.” Therefore has been italicized here since it explains the practical reason for this holy injunction.
Marx’s burst of indignation at this sociological strategy of Christianity was directed, in 1847, at a pious Prussian who sermonized that, “If only those whose calling it is to develop the social principles of Christianity do so, the Communists will soon be put to silence”:
The social principles of Christianity have now had eighteen hundred years to develop and need no further development by Prussian councilors.
The social principles of Christianity justified the slavery of Antiquity, glorified the serfdom of the Middle Ages, and equally know, when necessary, how to defend the oppression of the proletariat, although they make a pitiful face over it.
The social principles of Christianity preach the necessity of a ruling and an oppressed class, and all they have for the latter is the pious wish the former will be charitable.
The social principles of Christianity transfer the councilors’ adjustment of all infamies to heaven and thus justify the further existence of those infamies on earth.
The social principles of Christianity declare all vile acts of the oppressors against the oppressed to be either the just punishment of original sin and other sins or trials that the Lord in his infinite wisdom imposes on those redeemed.
The social principles of Christianity preach cowardice, self-contempt, abasement, submission, dejection, in a word all the qualities of the canaille; and the proletariat, not wishing to be treated as canaille, needs its courage, its self-reliance, its pride and its sense of independence more than its bread.
The social principles of Christianity are sneakish and the proletariat is revolutionary.
So much for the social principles of Christianity.48
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That’s interesting. Thanks. That takes a bit of digesting… and thought.
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It is a bit condensed for the article compared to the original which was in one of the books Marks and Engels wrote collaboratively.
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Thanks Alasdair. Perhaps the condensed, truncated treatment gave this version more of a staccato cadence attack. My imagined noise, as I read the Marx attack on the church reminded me of the young wasp I once watched as it attacked a much larger bee fly, efficient, effective and devastating.
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I was watching the telly and on it was a guy at a food bank handing out boxes of food. As he handed over a box he said to the recipient…” It’s not charity, it’s solidarity”.
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That’s good, Jake: solidarity rather than charity – solidarity being shoulder to shoulder whereas charity is top down.
It wasn’t always so; I’m sure Munguinites are all aware that the linguistic roots of charity and cherish are the same.
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Ed: Good point.
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Yes, Jake, it is.
I give to food banks becasue I feel a solidarity with the recipients. After all, there but for good fortune would go I.
It’s a pity that the government doesn’t feel a bit more solidarity with people though.
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Socialism is not a term I feel comfortable using – because I don’t know what it means. I never have been able to pint it down – and that makes it pretty much impossible for me to discuss it with anyone, because no one has been able to explain it to me without revealing that they don’t really have a clue either. What with being a Russianist and all, you might have thought it’s the sort of thing I should know, but I’ve never been able to make sense of it: it’s as slippery a term as El Dorado.
Maybe it’s because I think of us humans more anthropologically than economically, if you get my drift, and think more about what it means to be a member of a community than I do about pounds and pence. Many societies don’t operate money economies – and while we Westerners (and others) may think of them as primitive, they’re not the ones trashing the planet, generally speaking; and if their futures are under threat, it’s generally the fault of us greedy and wasteful, exploitative and short-termist types who live in societies where there are people who feel they can’t hold their heads up in public if they don’t have the latest iPhone or this year’s model GTi to tool around in.
My inability to see money as anything other than a social construct is probably why I’m such a failure according to the economic yardsticks and other criteria of “success” in common use among the more materialistically minded, but really can’t bring myself to care very much about it: I’ve seen what real poverty is during my time in Africa, and I’m economically so much better off than that, and in terms of physical comfort too: it taught me the meaning of “enough”.
Here’s a rhetorical question for you, Tris: what kind of human being actively approves of a society where men and women who have been physically and mentally wounded in the service of that society have to to rely on charity to survive? The Roman legions used to look after their veterans better. Johnson and all those other Tory b*astards down at Westminster disgust me: financially bloated and morally bankrupt, self-dealing hypocrites and malignant narcissists with all the ethical sense of an Ebola virus. For them, life is a zero-sum game – and they are determined to be the ones who come out of it with their pockets stuffed full of Monopoly money.
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Beautifully put, Ed.
It’s the troops thing that really rips my knitting.
The Cenotaph; the pomp; the order in which things are done; the fuss that is made of what the females are wearing…
Then once it’s over, for the top people it is drinks in the FCO and for a selected few, lunch at Buckingham Palace.
One of the things that impressed me about Corbyn was that after it was over, he went out into the street to talk to veterans instead of joining members of the royal family and top people in the FCO.
But the whole thing for most of them is all a show. Like the opening of parliament or the queen’s birthday. Once a year, make it look like you care and spend hundreds of millions on a bit show.
They dress expensively, they put on sad faces, they stand there for an hour. Then its off to sign a bill ensuring that beggars, including ex-servicemen, be moved off the streets during some obscure, lazy, fat princess’s wedding.
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Ed…..I very much enjoyed your comment:”Socialism is not a term I feel comfortable using – because I don’t know what it means.”
This resonates with me in a country (the USA) in a presidential election year, when the most vile epithet that can be thrown at a political opponent is “SOCIALIST.” Republicans have been calling Democrats socialists ever since FDR founded the American welfare state in the 1930’s with the landmark passage of the Social Security program. Democrats have never had a really good response to the Republicans’ socialist-shaming, except to point out the hypocrisy of right wing Republicans of a certain age who gleefully accept their monthly Social Security checks from the US Treasury even as they vilify the concept of socialism (which they usually equate with Stalin’s Russia.)
For my own purposes in an election year, I sometimes find it useful to throw around the epithet “socialist” myself. It’s what I sometimes like to call the extremely well fed, well housed, and generally well-off far left California Democrats who won’t leave their more libertarian-minded neighbors alone….neighbors who may not share their zeal to save the planet from plastic drinking straws and grocery bags for example, not to mention politically incorrect speech. No, this is not really a “socialist” thing in traditional economic terms, but it’s as good a vile epithet as any to sling at the “limousine liberals” of California in an election year. Apart from the fact that they are the most arrogantly annoying people on earth, the greater sin of the California Democrats is that their politically correct environmentally extreme liberalism can’t win electoral votes back in Wisconsin, Pennsylvania, Michigan, Ohio, and Florida where American presidents are elected.
As for the all-purpose political epithet “socialist,” I see that there is a term in the UK (and equivalent terms in other countries and languages) roughly equivalent to the American “limousine liberal.” That term is “Champagne Socialist.”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Champagne_socialist
But I digress! More to the point of this MNR entry and the nature of the comments appended thereto, Tris made reference to a discussion in a previous blog post. I posted a couple of links there that you may or may not have seen about the contrast between the nationalization of utilities and major industries by the Clement Attlee government of post-WWII Britain; and contrasted its perceived failure in the coal miner strikes and power shortages of the 1970’s, with the more highly regarded democratic socialism of the Nordic countries. This is the article (below) which argued that the Nordic form of socialism is not socialism at all, but is in fact a capitalist system which, combined with a very high rate of taxation, funds a generous welfare state.
The article is specifically addressed to the supporters of Bernie Sanders, who believed there was political hay to be made by declaring himself a socialist in an election year in America. That was a ticket to political oblivion, his popularity with young university radicals (who don’t actually vote in high numbers) notwithstanding. Fortunately, the Democrats who vote in the state primaries dumped Sanders before he took the Democratic Party down with him in the General.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/jeffreydorfman/2018/07/08/sorry-bernie-bros-but-nordic-countries-are-not-socialist/#dcbf82374ad3
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Spoiler alert: it’s half 4 in the morning and I’ve havered just a wee bit.
I’m so glad that I’m not the only one who thinks this way – in fact, in my first novel I introduce two characters by having them have this very conversation.
It’s a cruel conundrum because the only ones who can actually change these things are the super rich, but the onus is without fail dropped onto everyone else and you’re peer pressured into compliance – especially with the mindless hero worshipping that goes on with the military nowadays (emphasising the mindless part). The only ‘solution’ I can see is to make it such an unimaginable crisis that it’s politically necessary to take care of people but that’s hardly a good plan. If I give a homeless guy a quid is that just a little bit less that the government has to do, and a detriment to getting a government to do its blinking job? These are the philosophical and moral arguments that really screw up a person with anxiety disorder (me).
A government’s sole responsibility should be the well-being if it’s people and everything else is just cow faeces. Word war 1 was essentially an internal squabble between snobs, half of whom were part of the same inbred extended family! Getting the bigwigs around a table and hashing it out rationally is how it should be done but humans are too thick as a whole.
I hear Jeff bezos is worth 400-odd billion – how many fish suppers would that fetch?
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Well I know one certainly
In all of recorded history
Capitalism has never ever worked for all of the people.
Another word for socialism is
“Fairness “ for all and not a tiny
Greedy minority .
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Seems a fair comment, Niko.
Maybe that’s what the Nordic nations are trying for.
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Tris
When have any governments looked after service personnel or vulnerable people, not in this country. My father, sadly deceased 30 years now, fought in WW2 and came home to slums for heroes and no job and a pittance to live on, nothing’s changed and yet we put up with in this country and another example is Americans putting up with the same crap. Last nights big night in was again about the public paying more for services that any decent society would already have in place. If it wasn’t for the poor in this country putting their hands in their pockets we would have no services other than the basics. I don’t expect government to provide everything but I do expect government not to pay for wars and nuclear weapons, or passing on tax avoidance again to the poorest. I hate the UK I really do.
Bruce
Sent from my iPhone
>
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Bruce
Who would of guessed 🧐
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What do you like about it, Niko?
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Bruce: A long time ago I met an elderly guy who was chairman of the local Burma Star Association. He told me about the homecoming they had been promised when they were in Burma and how it compared to the reality of what he found, just what you said.
Appalling housing, no electricity, hot water,or bathrooms; terrible jobs on just livable wages. And back to the tipping of the cap to the bosses as they went by.
You’d have thought that a country which had ruled a quarter of the planet might have managed bathrooms for the workers.
I wonder how many bathrooms there were in Buckingham Palace, Clarence House, St James’s Palace, Windsor Castle and Kensington Palace… not to mention Holyrood.
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Charity is a lucrative career if you hit the big time. Look at https://www.thirdsector.co.uk/charity-pay-study-2019-top-earners-1-100/article/1579312 for the chief executive salaries.
I knew the Save the Children boss got nearly 1/4 million but that’s a way down the list. There was a stooshie a few years ago when this became known. Looking down the list I see that there is another Save the Children boss who gets £150K.
I don’t give a penny to charity.
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Interesting list.
See Eton College is a Charity.
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Yes, they get tax relief.
What a lovely country we have.
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Davie
Your all heart 💖
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– Of stone
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Dave: I agree completely.
About 12 years ago, at the time of the financial crisis (caused by the bankers), I started giving money to a local independent food bank. I did so on a regular basis, as did some of my friends and family.
They, when the Tories got in and started the austerity programme, they were “taken over” by Trussell Trust. (Motto: Every town should have one.)
I continued to give, and even did an interview for a TV documentary for them.
Then, thanks partly to Mark Frankland, I learned more about them. Their directors too, were on handsome salaries.
The local food bank manager was leaving and I decided to apply for his job. Feeding people, it seemed to me, was something I would like to do.
I have no idea what the salary was, because when I applied, they asked me first which church I attended.
When I indicated that I didn’t attend church at all and never had, I was told that I couldn’t apply.
The reason was that the Trussell Trust was a charity built on Christian principles and that to be a member of staff you had to share these principles.
However, they said that I could volunteer with them if I wished to,
So, my non-Christain principles were good enough to work for them unpaid, but if I wanted a salary I had to be a practising Christian.
I stopped my donations immediately and found two other food banks, local and independent… both of them associated with religion, but demanding no adherence to any faith to be involved with them.. or to benefit from them. One Christian and one Muslim.
That seemed a more worthwhile use of my funds, than directors’ salaries and a posh London address.
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That’s an amazing story Tris! A practicing Christian can be paid a salary, but otherwise, your labor must be non-remunerated. How wonderfully “christian” of them. 😦
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I thought that, Danny. So I told them to stuff it and went elsewhere.
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Tris
I’ve said it on here before.
It is an scandal that the facilities at Erskine for disabled servicemen is a CHARITY.
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It’s incomprehensible to me, Dave.
If everyone stopped giving, what would happen to these men and women?
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I am a Trustee/Director of a local charity, in our articles only staff get paid. our “boss” is on just over £23K and for that she really does too much.
I think as charities become National the pay scales at the top become ridiculous.
I used to donate regularly to the SSPCA until I discovered what they pay their CEO . The Scottish National Trust is another example of bloated payments at the top.
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Aucheorn, do you happen to know whether that paragon of Scottish manhood, Neil Oliver, draws down any salary from our National Trust, and if so, how much?
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Ed…And how much it would be in New Zealand dollars…
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Aucheorn: Their reasoning is always that to run a massive organisation like the SSPCA or SNT, you need to attract good management and you can only do that by paying top dollar.
It seems a very British way of doing things.
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I have been angry at the outbreak of events raising money for what should be a fundamental public service,so I completely agree with the German chappie.
This crisis has underlined the necessity of a fully funded public health and care service and the debate has to be in future,how do we fund it.
The idea of health care only being for the rich is where the London establishment has been heading but unless they intend living on a desert island,it is clear that everyone is important in modern society.
You cannot eat a hedge and care workers,delivery drivers etc are just as important to our basic survival,if not more so than wealthy financiers.
Johnson and his pals are not programmed to take that lesson on board however and they will be trying their best to return to ye good olde days,as fast as their stock brokers will let them.
Some Scots will agree with that but hopefully the majority will see that we need to go our own way and not have restrictions placed on our aspirations by an alien government in England.
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I think that the notion that we are all important in our own way will take a long time to get through to Brits who measure everything in financial terms.
Soldiers are important when they are at war, but not important when they come home.
At the moment nurses and doctors are important, but it’s not so long ago that in England, the Tories voted against a pay rise for nurses and cheered when it went through. In Scotland they got their pay rise.
(No one remembers that there are other people working in these hospitals with virus patients… cleaners, porters, radiologists, physios, chefs and kitchen staff…etc, etc.)
But when, if ever, this is over, nurses and doctors will be demoted to another load of public servants wanting too much money and using too many resources.
You’re only useful while you’re useful.
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eddjasfreeman,
I used to think I knew what socialism was, all the happy clappy fully funded NHS, no colonial wars, decolonsation, denuclearisation, that sort of thing. Oh! And equality of opportunity, especially education.
It is a shame that the people elected to enable these ‘nice’ things seemed to have somewhat baser natures and were always willing to allow ‘the establishment’ to drag them down. It is a shame that folk that took us up the hill, marched us straight back down.
I became disillusioned with our two party system where it became harder and harder to see any difference between one party and t’other. The somewhat self-serving alliance between Labour and Tory at Hollyrood and at Westminster was the final nail in the coffin.
I still believe in the happy clappy stuff, the Labour Party doesn’t any more.
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The Labour Party adapted to what the South East of England wanted.
Mandelson admitted as much in his book about New Labour.
His view was what is the point in having socialist principles if you are permanently out of power.
Conundrum.
Alternative question. What is the point in being a party of the people if you become Tories?
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OT
Someone just sent me a vid,NOWeo of the trump’s latest,the man’s a genius.
Suggesting we inject dettol to cure us.
It finishes with,
In Bleach trump, NOW
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We can have a bleach party instead of a beach party at Broughty Ferry. Everyone goes out with a Cillit Bang.
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LOL… In a Flash!
All led by Milly Weir!
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Bless her… 🙂
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Lol I heard about his dettol cure.
Has Trump just bought shares in the company?
Inbleach… love it.
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Dave…Tris…..Perhaps that picture of Trumpy was taken during the explanation about his household disinfectant cure for Covid-19. He also suggested getting light into the human body some way, since he’d heard that sunlight kills the virus on surfaces. The president’s medical suggestion has led to warnings from the medical community that people should not ingest bleach or other household cleaners.
The makers of Lysol have issued a statement that their product should not be injected or consumed.
It’s really a little embarrassing to have a president who is certifiably insane. (Election day is still six months away after all.)
https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2020/04/24/disinfectant-injection-coronavirus-trump/
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8251605/Donald-Trump-suggests-bizarre-treatments-coronavirus-including-injections.html
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The guy that Trump likes to call “fake news” is Philip Rucker, the well respected White House Bureau Chief for the Washington Post. He wrote the book: “A Very Stable Genius: Donald J. Trump’s Testing of America.”
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I’m the president… nah nah nah nah nah…
I say test it out on him.
What an embarrassment.
I thought the British ones were bad, but WOW.
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Yes, Trumpy seems to feel that the “I’m president and you’re not…..nah nah nah nah ” is a devastating response to a reporter’s hard question. He uses it a lot. 😉
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Well… it’s an impressive put down to a senior journalist with a highly respected paper!
He’s a stunner is your president.
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Tris….Trumpy makes De Pfeffel look like a statesman. 😉
I imagine that Trumpy was more than a little pissed off at the book that was co-authored by Phil Rucker (the Post reporter.)
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Sad thing is that I beleive it all.
This…
Rucker and Leonnig reveal Trump at his most unvarnished, showing the unhinged decision-making and incompetence that has floored officials and stunned foreign leaders. They portray unscripted calls with Vladimir Putin, steak dinners with Kim Jong-un, and calls with Theresa May so hostile that they left her aides shaken. They also take a hard look at Robert Mueller, Trump’s greatest antagonist to date, and how his investigation slowly unravelled an administration whose universal value is loyalty – not to country, but to the president himself.
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Me too! I should probably get a copy of that book. Phil is a senior reporter with lots of White House sources who appears on MSNBC a lot, and I remember when he and Carol were doing the book tour. He is the Post’s bureau chief at the White House and she is a national investigative reporter for the Post.
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‘Takes us behind the scenes of the Trump presidency, where we learn that the private Trump is – if you can believe it – even worse than what you see every day’ Washington Post.
Worth $12, I’d say.
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Tris…..The “Stable Genius” book sounded good on the book tour interviews.
As for the “Why I Love Donald Trump” book, I wonder if its serious, and I wonder who William Smith is, and assuming the Smith guy is serious, I wonder if they let him have sharp objects…..LOL.
Not much of a clue about Smith upon some quick Googling. There’s a William Smith who writes Bible books. Sounds like that Smith could be a right wing Trump lover. 😉
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Sounds the type.
Thought you might be interested in this… he doesn’t deal with the blood of Jesus.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-52399464
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In an ideal world the President of the United States of America and the stupidest person in the country should be two different people.
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Ha ha ha ha ha
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Panda Paws:…….LOL….LOL……love that!
Yes, that would be the ideal. 😉
There’s a news report that he’s now claiming he was just being “sarcastic.” The “sarcastic” claim is one that he’s often used in the past when trying to walk back something he’s said that’s monumentally stupid even by HIS standards. Now he says: “I was asking a question sarcastically to reporters … to see what would happen.”
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/trump-coronavirus-inject-disinfectant-quote-a9483151.html
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Brilliant, PP. Still tittering over that.
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Oh heavens, Danny. Next they are going to have to issue “Do not cut your family open so sunlight can get inside them” warnings.
Frightening. But of course, his loyal support will almost undoubtedly think that he’s got it solved.
I’m suprised that he hasn’t made more of that lady who refused (somewhere down south, of course) to self isolate saying she was safe because she was “washed in the blood of Jesus”!
Bleach and the blood of Jesus and a thousand cuts and you’ll never catch the virus…
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Yes Tris…..I thought of the blood of Jesus lady when I heard that.
It really is amazing that the makers of household cleaners have to issue press releases to keep people from doing things that Trumpy suggests as Covid disease cures. I suppose they think they must since the couple in Florida swallowed Chloroquine fish tank cleaner. I guess they thought Trump said it was OK.
https://www.npr.org/sections/coronavirus-live-updates/2020/03/24/820512107/man-dies-woman-hospitalized-after-taking-form-of-chloroquine-to-prevent-covid-19
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Dear heavens.
These poor people.
Someone please please put him in a bin before he kills any other people stupid enough not to see the fool for what he is.
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Absolutely! What a terrible thing!
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Like the people who protest in tightly-packed crowds carrying their guns (presumably to shoot that god dang commie Coronavirus dead?), bleach drinkers are a problem which will eliminate itself, given time. Isn’t nature (or god?) elegant.
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Trumpy ducked out of the Friday pandemic briefing without taking any questions from reporters. By all accounts, he realizes he made a fool of himself, and may be rethinking his bizarre appearances at the daily White House pandemic briefings (which he’s been using in place of presidential campaign rallies that can’t be held now.)
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Poor man craves an audience. Basically he’s a Vaudeville act, and not a very good one.
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LOL. True, Neil. Give them time.
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I’m sceptical about the therapeutic benefits of injecting or ingesting bleach, however given that the virus needs a live host it’ll cut down transmission rates. I suppose it’s really just a more pro-active version of the Johnson/Cummings neglect & indifference strategy.
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Ignore Trumpy at your peril, Jake… !!!!
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I was reading an article about Trump earlier tonight. It was mostly dismissive of his ideas and insights, but they did quote this comment of his on his ‘phone call with Boris. “Boris is incredible” said The Donald. So, for once I agree with him, because I don’t find Boris credible either.
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LOL, Jake.
I have to admit that on this occasion, I would have to agreed with Trump. Absolutely incredible!
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Capitalism is operating in areas of society where it shouldn’t be operating. For example: education, health, natural resources, natural monopolies like transport are all marketised. All of these are owned and or controlled by market forces. These are areas which should be socialised, brought under control by a non market driven government to preserve the smooth running of a society.
I imagine the worlds billionaires exist because of the plundering of the earths natural resources with the help of neo liberal (rabid capitalism) government.
Capitalism belongs to those talented people who have skills that people compete for their services and products which are in demand.
Trump and Johnson can’t sing, dance, act, direct movies, make art, make music or just about anything else apart from appeasing their corporate masters.
The UK and the USA haven’t learnt the fine art of telling these people to get tae fuck.
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To each his own, but we have seen what has happened when public services were make private.
Initially in England, people couldn’t afford water to flush toilets and didn’t do the washing up properly.
When they privatised prisons, the only objective became to make money… same with Young Offenders’ Institutes and then the probation service.
British trains are, without doubt, the least efficient and most expensive in Europe… to be fair not that they were that good before.
I can’t seriously think of one thing that they privatised that is better than it was before.
But maybe that is just the incredibly greed of the Brits. Maybe it works other places.
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Breaking news.
The chancer of the UK has decided to give support to Virgin Atlantic’s owner,branson the pickle.
Mr sunak apologises for the delay BUTT the method to be used was to return ALL the tax paid by branson over the years.
After much searching they have now managed to tot up and sign a cheque.
Unfortunately it will cost so much to post the 20p cheque that a credit note for next year has been passed to HMRC.
Hopefully ricky will be overjoyed to learn of his good fortune.
I just calculated the rise in the state pension in the UK,it’s under 50p a day, don’t tryto spend it on hand gel as it won’t buy you a small bottle.
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LOL…
I wonder if Branson is the most hated man in the UK.
|I’m not normally a cruel person, but I laughed like a drain when his private island was hit by a hurricane and his house and garden were left a wreck.
It wouldn’t have happened if he still ben in Blighty!
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We submit to our God. Of all the people in all the world – God proclaimed Richard Branson – and the waves parted and other shit. And after a bit of coughing and spluttering Richard Branson rose from the depths. We were astounded! Moderately surprised even.
Then the devil laughed and the baby died?
The day sanity died.
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Very poetic, Douglas.
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I was trying for persuasivness. There are far better folk than me:
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you did not bad
🙂
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Long have I desired to view the demesnes and curtilage of Munguin Towers, and enjoy the company of like-minded Munguinites in the comfortable domestos setting of one of the many reception rooms thrown open to the public in happier times by the munificent Mr. Munguin who, it is to be hoped, will quit his apartment long enough to grace our gathering with his socially distant presence.
We rest secure in the knowledge that Munguin’s doorknobs are always thoroughly sanitised using the Dettol Anti-Bac wipes so recently the object of American President Trump’s award of his personal seal of approval as a veritable mithridate and specific to rival hydroxychloroquine in the treatment of the SARS-CoV-2 virus.
It has come to my notice also that Dettol Anti-Bac wipes may advantageously be impregnated with hand sanitising gel and an appropriate Eau de Cologne to serve as combination pomanders and handkerchiefs, and may be scrunched up and worn within the N95 mask to annihilate any stray virions which may breach the outer defences.
Alas, I have not yet been able to source a 4XL Biocontainment Level 4 suit; as so often, they do not make them in sizes larger than 2XL and even Slater Menswear (renowned retailer of outer garments for the maturer, fuller figure) on the High Street do not carry that type of suiting; that being the case, I must make my plea for our foregathering to be postponed sine die, until appropriate PPE may be found and oxygen cylinders obtained – the latter are in short supply, it seems, which is odd given that oxydol forms 20.95% of our atmosphere.
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LOL… Shoulda kept that on from “Just for a Laugh”, Ed.
Even Munguin smiled at his dear old Uncle Ed.
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Well , it is probably not something dead are aware of, but those of that are alive are quite pleased to be alive, It is pretty obvious that your milage varies.
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Just had my daily dose of UV.
Now for my Friday night intake of bleach.
Speak Monday,maybe.
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Would that be some sort of Scottish bleach?
I hear that French medics are looking into the statistics which show that people who smoke are less likely to catch the virus.
Obviously they are not recommmending smoking, but they are trying to isolate in tobacco which one of the poisons it contains works against the virus.
They are starting with Noctine patches.
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Maybe the other substance might be more helpful,the alcohol,just take the normal version, can be a pleasant experience in moderation.
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Hennig’s right.
Every time Children in Need raises £20m, that’s £20m the govt has already raised through taxation but not spent as it should. Gets them off the hook.
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Likewise for service personnel.
I’d never discourage people giving or helping in whatever way they cold, but people pay high taxes in this country and while people raise money for things that are important to them, the government then gets to spend that tax take on self aggrandisement, badly run projects and Buckingham Palace.
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