55 thoughts on “REMEMBER, THE TORIES DIDN’T WANT DEVOLUTION”

  1. Don’t suppose the 26 Countries in the EU who hate England would take our side and allow us to stay as we are with a seat in Brussels and become the 27th when England departs?
    Would the United Nations be interested too? Must try everything!

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    1. “Hate” is too strong a word for it, though there is no doubt there is a pretty high degree of pissed-offedness… On the other hand, there is a lot of good will towards us Scots among the EU member States.

      It is my considered opinion that it would be a great good thing if Scotland were to become independent before the 29 March 2019 Brexit date – that way we can claim continuity of membership (the Usual Suspects would say that there is no legal basis for yadda yadda yadda, but there is quite a lot, actually, and with the political will to do it, it will be done – we can effectively guarantee that the Irish would be on side, for example).

      And the great good thing would be – having left the EU, the rUK would have nothing to say about it! (Oh, we know, we know, they are ignorant and arrogant enough to try, but in an independent State of our own, we would at last be able to just point and laugh at them…)

      The UN – we would have plenty of sponsors for UN membership, arrangements for it will be made, and it can be done pretty quickly. Now if only I still had my apartment in New York, that would be good enough to get the ball rolling with temporary premises for our Permanent Mission to the United Nations…

      At the UN, the rUK could conceivably throw its weight around as it is one of the Permanent Five (US, UK, France, Russia, China) and therefore wields veto power in the Security Council. They would, however, be unwise to do so. I don’t recall there being any fuss or muss over UN membership for both parts when Czechoslovakia split. I expect it was in the treaty they signed when they went their separate ways; I translated it, but at this remove I just can’t remember.

      One side-effect of Scottish independence that the rUK will doubtless find annoying is that it will have to change its name: it won’t be able to go on calling itself the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland any more. I hardly need spell it out to any Munguinite, of course, but it won’t be a “United Kingdom” because it will have only one bit of that political entity that’s a kingdom; it won’t be anything “of Great Britain” because we’ve got the top third of the island (the best bit, of course), and as for Norniron … well…

      They’ll probably just call the whole thing England, but Brexiteer types do that already, so no news there.

      (Digression alert!) It always amuses me when I see crowds of dimwits waving the flag of St. George and being all blood-and-soil nationalistic – “It’s AAH COUNTRY!” – unaware that if St. George were alive today they’d want him thrown out as a Syrian immigrant.

      As for Scotland, in the general order of things, at the UN we would most often find ourselves sitting between Saudi Arabia and Senegal, so anyone with a desire to be our Ambassador to the UN should probably start studying matters Islamic right now, if they haven’t already. Actually, we could do a lot worse than send Humza, if he would agree to stop being a politician – but he should definitely wear a kilt, because that way – no one would ever forget him, and Scotland’s image and presence on the international scene would be immensely and immediately enhanced.

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      1. Maybe hate is too strong. But I’m convinced that many in the EU will be happy to see the back of the offshore bit that is always awkward.

        Interesting you mention the name of RUK. I read an article today in the Independent and it quotes Labour’s Frank Field as follows:

        “Our departure should be the starting gun for a renaissance across the whole of public life as a new pride in being British, or English as it is now more often expressed, sweeps across our affairs.”

        https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-latest-house-of-lords-eu-uk-abolish-labour-mp-frank-field-a8406461.html

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    2. I know that Nicola Sturgeon has maintained a good relationship with the EU

      https://cdn.images.express.co.uk/img/dynamic/1/590x/Nicola-Sturgeon-and-Michel-Barnier-965842.jpg?r=1527453224114

      There is, in any case, precedent for parts of a country to be in, and part to be out, of the EU.

      The Kingdom of Denmark has Denmark, Faroe Islands and Kallaallit Nunaat (Greenland). THe mainland of Denmark is in the EU, the other two parts of the Kingdom are not.

      There is no reason why Scotland couldn’t be in the Union while England and Wales were. The only reason NI wouldn’t go for that is Forster the Dinosaur denier.

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  2. If nothing else comes out of all these shenanigans,it is now crystal clear that the sole purpose of the Tory party in Holyrood is to block independence and ensure Scotland does not deviate from England in any meaningful way.
    They have nothing to offer Scots beyond that,which makes them irrelevant to any future Scots may decide for themselves beyond London rule.
    The other London based parties try to hide behind the big bad Tory narrative but as we have seen,when push comes to shove,they are no different really and have no vision for Scotland either.
    Offering Scots nothing other than a guaranteed hit to their economy and less than the already limited say in what happens in Scotland is not going to win them any votes other than the lunatic unionist fundamentalists.

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    2. Not nearly enough people know about what’s happening: after all, the meeja generally doesn’t say anything at all if it can’t make it an SNPBAD story. So – I haven’t checked – I imagine those who listen to such stuff heard a fair amount about the SNP’s “attention-seeking” walkout, and very little about what provoked it, other than Blackford got chucked out for giving Bercow cheek.

      The Usual Suspects can then say, insouciantly, that Scots don’t care about x, y or z that we independentistas care deeply about – although many, many more Scots would care, a lot, if they were ever properly informed about what x, y or z was.

      I do a lot of asking people who have the misfortune to get trapped in my orbit what they know about – ach, I’m tired of x, y and z – a, b and c, and they are not nearly as informed as I think they need to be. Of course, this is quite deliberate policy on the part of yer ackshl BritNat Establishment. And you don’t have to be a swivel-eyed loon in a tinfoil hat to believe in the existence of said BritNat Establishment, more’s the pity.

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      2. Yes, someone tweeted yesterday that the average Scot doesn’t care about powers being taken away from them…

        … they will when the frackers move in under their house.

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        2. Brian Wilson claimed in the Hootsmon that barely one in a hundred Scots knows about or cares about the “power grab”. I suspect a lot will know soon enough if they don’t now.

          I think fracking may be a game changer here since elsewhere it has attracted support from a wide social and political mix and might create a common cause for people currently on different sides in the Indy debate.

          I also share the suspicion that Fox would probably like UK to become the 51st state. I sometimes think, however, given the emotive appeal of states’ rights in the USA, and the willingness of some states to cock a snoot at Washington, we might be better off in that position than as a helpless supplicant desperate for any scraps from Trump’s table. If it is also true that Trump is acutely aware of the USA’s highly unfavourable trade balance with the U.K., then it seems to me that any trade deal with the US will be for the latter’s benefit.

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          1. Aye that’s a fair point… Certainly the states have far more power than we do.

            Their powers of course is NOT devolved power and can’t be “taken back”.

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  3. I, personally especially hate their desire to retain control over fracking and nuclear waste and think it is utterly wrong. There are areas of this country whose landscape has been devastated by open cast coal mining. The promises of dirty CO2 fuel attract the attention of the most voracious capitalists on the planet. Why the heck should we expect protection from them by Westminster? Westminster is part of a nexus of exploitation that actually sides with the guys in the black hats.

    IMHO Westminster would sell us on as a commodity, just because they could. And sell us out they will, if we let them. For they have had centuries of exploitation on their side, and we, as a nation, have accepted it.

    I do not believe a word that they say about anything. That is how divorced I have become from the Westminster bubble.

    I think that that is a healthy attitude.

    Thoughts?

    Liked by 6 people

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    1. No, they have proved themselves to be liars, particularly that idiot Mundell, although with him one is never sure whether he’s mendacious, weak or incompetent. My money is on all three.

      They promise that this will only last 7 years, but by that time this lot will be long gone, and it’s an established fact that they cannot legislate for what a future government will do.

      And here’s betting they will delight in overturning fracking bans, or moratoria (whichever) and dumping as much of their nuclear waste as they can in our country.

      I wouldn’t trust them to run a bath.

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    2. The necessary attitude to take towards whatever They say can be hard work, because what we need is total scepticism, absent corroborating evidence to the contrary. In other words, we have to assume that none of it is true.

      Although we should pay attention to what They do rather than what They say – the “total scepticism” mental workout reveals Their propaganda and lies, and then we have to analyse their garbage not just for internal (logical) consistency in a single stream of utterances, but over time as well as the narrative twists, turns and weasels around. Then we need to see how the rhetoric relates to the facts, if there is in fact any relationship at all.

      The present moment in the history of the Western world will be looked on in history as an evil time when the old demons – right-wing demagoguery, fascism / authoritarianism, hatred and bigotry, xenophobia in general and racism in particular, hateful, hostile propaganda, anti-democratic political attitudes and forces, the deliberate creation by Government of hostile environments, abuses of the poor, the disabled, children – grew and thrived once more. This is a post-factual social and political universe right now. We are awash in an ocean of lies.

      Much of it serves as a distraction, deliberate or not, from vital issues facing us – such as the survival of our species on an overpopulated, polluted, resource-depleted and environmentally damaged planet. Isn’t it interesting how many climate-change deniers there are among right-wing politicians and meeja people?

      I am not a conventionally religious person, but when I heard the Attorney-General of the United States of America, an evil, racist b*astard called Jeff Sessions, quote from the New Testament in justification of his and Trump’s policy of ripping the children away from their parents seeking asylum in the US, I couldn’t help thinking that Satan is the Father of Lies. And Ms. May is a vicar’s daughter.

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      1. I couldn’t agree more Ed. And to quote a well known line from the Usual Suspects.

        The greatest trick the Devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn’t exist.

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      1. Of that I have absolutely no doubt.

        First the AQmericans know (as do all other potential trade partners, that the UK is desperate.

        NEVER go into a negotiation if the other side knows that you are desperate.

        It’s like buying something like a car. You go in, and no matter how much you want it, set the price that you are willing to pay. If the other side agrees, fine. If they don’t, you walk away.

        If you let them know how much you want that car, you’ll never get a deal.

        Added to that, look who is in charge of the trade deals. Liam Fox.

        As thick as two short planks, and utterly devoted to the USA.

        I suspect that Foxy would be happy if the UK was the 51st state.

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  4. trispw,

    “And here’s betting they will delight in overturning fracking bans, or moratoria (whichever) and dumping as much of their nuclear waste as they can in our country.”

    Exactly. I wouldn’t give that bunch 7 minutes as opposed to 7 years!

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    1. I think it was Stuart Campbell that tweeted about it. He was saying that the DUP lot think that Britain loves them and they are an integral part of this family of nations.

      But that in fact the mainland doesn’t really give a stuff about them (although he used more colourful language).

      I think it also shows that, despite the very obvious downsides of Brexit, with all that we now know, the xenophobia stirred up by the tabloids, and the right wing parties, has a lasting effect.

      Perhaps there has been a swing to remain in areas which will be very badly effected, but overall the feeling is still pretty much for Brexit.

      Maybe, in fairness to May, this is why, despite the problems it is causing, she feels she is doing the right thing.

      Thanks for the link. I’ve bookmarked it for reading in more depth. The first thing a notices as I scanned down to p34 was that in Paisley’s constituency, they aren’t seeing any great benefits of the bribe that the DUP received for keeping May in a job. Interesting.

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      1. I am not sure that the DUP think this.
        It should have been clear,even to the DUP,that Westminster was prepared to throw them under a bus in December in order to move onto trade negotiations with the EU.
        Only saved by a last minute lie from May to the EU.
        Arlene knows full well that the only thing holding them together with England is the threat to bring down the May administration.
        A family held together by blackmail and threats will not last long as a cohesive unit,especially when the main “partner” has made it clear it is either their way or else.
        The DUP are in an unenviable place,currently having promises from Westminster about cash to mitigate the effects of Brexit but will get blamed by voters when the cash dries up,as it inevitably will.

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        1. Any promises from Westminster to devolved governments aren’t worth the paper they are written on.

          The DUP, already expecting extra cash for the health service, will now find that their voters will have to pay more tax.

          Never ever trust Westminster.

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    2. Interestingly Niko, Wings has an article up at the moment about this very topic. Wings carried out an opinion poll earlier in the year on people who were born in England and living in England, so it was very specific in its target “audience” for the questions, One of the questions that was asked was on the same subject as Ashcroft re: how do they feel about Brexit or keeping Scotland/N.I. in the union.

      Just like the Ashcroft poll the results were, how can I say this, rather astounding. 🤔

      When broken down into which party the respondent supported/voted for in both polling results the one thing that stands out above everything else is that the people who most want rid of Scotland and N.I. are … erm … the TORIES! 😂

      That’s right folks the Conservative and UNIONIST party is the the party whose members/supporters most want rid of Scotland and N.I.

      I wonder if anyone has informed the Great Dictator yet of this incredible news yet? 😂

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      1. Arbroath, you’ve pinpointed one of most glaring absurdities of the (Conservative &) Unionist position, which is that they so bizarrely want to be part of an organization or polity that they know – or should know – will never treat them as anything better than second class, and eminently disposable.

        Dr. Freeman’s diagnosis: they have serious, untreated cases of the Cringe warping their judgement. Chuck in a shed load of ill-assorted sectarian crap as well, and you have a recipe for serious – um – not “cognitive impairment”, I suppose – for seriously perturbed thought processes.

        You know, some of them are so disturbed that it wouldn’t surprise me at all if they were dinosaur-denying, climate-change denying, science- and fact-denying religious bigots who believe the Earth was created 6,000 years ago by God, and are absolutely certain that anyone who says any different is bound straight for eternal damnation in hell.

        Whose quaint idea was predestination anyway?

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        1. To be honest eddjasfreeman the very fact the call themselves the Conservative and Unionist party is enough to make sure I know full well they haven’t got a clue about either Conservatism or Unionism. 😂

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          1. Yup – that pretty much nails it – “clueless”. Funny how mugshots of Murdo Fraser and Ross Thomson pop into one’s mind’s eye on hearing the word. “Clueless” – oh – there they are again – and me without my water pistol.

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  7. I am not sure that the DUP think this.
    It should have been clear,even to the DUP,that Westminster was prepared to throw them under a bus in December in order to move onto trade negotiations with the EU.
    Only saved by a last minute lie from May to the EU.
    Arlene knows full well that the only thing holding them together with England is the threat to bring down the May administration.
    A family held together by blackmail and threats will not last long as a cohesive unit,especially when the main “partner” has made it clear it is either their way or else.
    The DUP are in an unenviable place,currently having promises from Westminster about cash to mitigate the effects of Brexit but will get blamed by voters when the cash dries up,as it inevitably will.

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    1. (Assumes posture of faux outrage) My goodness, Bringiton! You seem to be saying that Tories might not live up to their promises, that they might even have lied! You impyoon their honour! Shocking!

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  9. Seems to me the Brexiteers hard Brexit is going to come to pass.

    they are sealing of all the exits bar one .

    This royal throne of kings, this scepter’d isle,
    This earth of majesty, this seat of Mars,
    This other Eden, demi-paradise,
    This fortress built by Nature for herself
    Against infection and the hand of war,
    This happy breed of men, this little world,
    This precious stone set in the silver sea,
    Which serves it in the office of a wall,
    Or as a moat defensive to a house,
    Against the envy of less happier lands,
    This blessed plot, this earth, this realm, this England

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    2. Classic sociopathy. Sheer contempt with an armourplate cover story (to themselves) I was only giving them a sweetie/I was only joking.

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  11. **WARNING: FREEMAN RANT ALERT**

    Off topic again, but relevant to us as we suffer under the leopardskin jackboot of May and her “hostile environment for immigrants”: http://tinyurl.com/y83j5b9s.

    It is an article from the American “Salon” magazine, and relates to the new and outrageous – i.e., cause for outrage – policy of the Orange One’s administration, of jailing toddlers and babies snatched from their parents at the US/Mexico border. The policy is the particular brainchild, it would seem, of one of Trump’s inner circle who is, quite frankly, not something you would like to find sticking to your shoe.

    It is worth recalling that Trump Senior was a fascist, racist, White supremacist b*astard too, and a member of the Klan – he was arrested in the 1920s when the Klan staged a march in New York City. Both he – Trump I – and Trump II were and have been found guilty of systemic racial discrimination in letting the housing stock they owned and own. Like father, like son… no wonder the man is such a psychological f*uck-up.

    Oh, and don’t forget the sectarian bigotry either – Catholics were not welcome, White members of reformed churches only were allowed, and the rest could go to hell.

    Orange… orange… funny, that rings some sort of a bell – something to do with Scotland and Norniron, and Arlene Foster – no, can’t think what it is.

    Note: in the US, people of Hispanic origin, i.e., Spanish and Portuguese (sensu lato), are not considered White, however “pure” their White European genetic heritage.

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    1. It is worth remembering a couple of things.

      The USA’s ‘border’ policy was preceded by our ‘Calais’. We are not ‘innocent bystanders’. 20 odd miles of sea doesn’t equal a moral victory.

      It was said by someone more intelligent than I that, “the way we treat immigrants, is the way that the government want’s to treat us.”

      We should think about that.

      Theresa May’s government has, ahem, fascist tendencies, and is it not a particularly
      good look.

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      2. Quite so.

        Any regime that plans to create a “hostile environment” for “immigrants” – who may, of course, include civilian adults and children fleeing war zones in which Great British bombs are being dropped on people – is already guilty of human rights abuses.

        I read today – if I could remember where, I would tell you – that the UK regime has now been condemned by five separate international bodies, including the relevant bit of the UN and the Council of Europe, for its systematic and grave violations of the rights of disabled people. Needless to say, the Westminster regime has rejected all criticism and continues to increase the harm it is doing. What next: eliminating “defectives” to reduce the burden on the rest of society? Come back Adolf Hitler, all is forgiven?

        No wonder the social atmosphere in England has become so toxic, so filled with both focused and free-floating hostility and hatred. Not that Scotland is immune, but at least we know where it is coming from, in the main.

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      1. The good news is that the evil, lying, hypocritical, toxic orange toad has finally backed down on his family separation and child abuse policy, after saying he couldn’t. This is a guy who said he could shoot someone dead in broad daylight on 5th Avenue and no one would come after him, and that he can pardon himself for anything… but – ach, why go on. Wake me if he tells the truth sometime, but don’t bother if it was only by accident.

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