FOR HEAVEN’S SAKE…

There’s daft, then there’s stupid, then there’s mad as a box of frogs, then, Ladies and Gentlemen, I give you  Mr Liam Fox:

aliam

Firstly, Liam, all male MPs wear ties all the time in the chamber. The Speaker, until very recently, would have throw them out if they didn’t. Do you mean that ALL MPs should wear them? Including your boss Mrs May?  Or do you mean they should wear them all the time? Allegedly Mr Rees Mogg stands up for ‘God Save the Queen’ even when he’s in the bath. (Take a lesson Mr Corbyn.) I wonder if  Jacob already wears a tie for that?

But, Liam, the UK makes other things besides ties.

What about these wonderful jams? Should MPs wear raspberry or strawberry?

Even Govey… yes, GOVEY…looks like he thinks yer mad.

agove

I’m wondering if Mr Werrity has a tie business…

53 thoughts on “FOR HEAVEN’S SAKE…”

  1. Ah, the necktie; that quintessential English piece of attire. Invented in Croatia and brought to prominence during the 30 years war, via Croatian mercenaries; in the employ of King Lois XIII.

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    1. Ah… all our problems are sorted. Jam, marmalade and Toblerone cases for Saudi.

      Yipeeeee, the golden days are just around the corner.

      Munguin may break out another case of Armand de Brignac Dynastie in celebration

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  7. Love your blog but I think there is a faux-pas with this one. Didn’t the speaker of the House of Commons rule the other day that it was no longer necessary for male members of parliament to wear a tie in the chamber? If so your comment about then being thrown out if they didn’t is no longer correct. Notwithstanding there are some real slack-jawed swivel-eyed loonies in the Brexit camp and Liam Fox is the daddy of them all. Keep up the excellent work.

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    1. Hi Kingseat…

      Thanks for your kind words.

      Yes, it’s true that (and I didn’t know it when I wrote the piece) Bercow has taken a lighter approach to the tie business. A few years ago he actually told an MP to put on a tie or leave the chamber. I’m not sure that he has actually said that men can appear sans tie, but he’s certainly indicated that it’s not the end of the world.

      So, yes, I guess you are right. It seems they would no long be thrown out. I’ll change the post accordingly. 🙂

      I heard the tail end of a discussion on Radio 4 this morning about the need to continue to call each other “hon members” and “rt hon members” and rt hon and learned members” and all that, rather than just calling people by their names.

      The person proposing that it should stay like that said that it protected the dignity of the place. Seriously, that bunch of braying morons actually think that Westminster has dignity?

      I sometimes listen to Fox and wonder how it is possible for someone so deluded to get on in the UK.

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  8. As an ardent Tory I can’t help but think that who-ever really runs the Party has put them into self-destruct mode or is quite simply taking the piss. The only explanations for appointing the charisma-free, ridiculous and accident-prone Mrs May as Prime Minister? The racist and homophobic Boris as ‘Foreign Secretary? Mr Fox -” I put personal interests ahead of public interests” – involved in Brexit negotiations? Allowing the publicity seeking and First Minister in waiting Davidson to be promoted from Private to Colonel – Colonel Bogey eat your heart out! Oh, I nearly forgot, and who can blame me. the ludicrous Gove and his ‘ties that bind’!

    Perhaps Niko can expain what his allies are doing?

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    1. Dean will be happy to see that you have become an ardent Tory, John.

      I suspect that after Brexit no one of any calibre at all wanted the job. So the leadership contest was between a pile of utter no hopers:
      Johnson, buffoon;
      Gove, joke;
      Leadsom, nonentity;
      Fox, humourless self-serving fool;
      May. the only one standing.

      I can only assume that once they have made a mess of Brexit as they most surely will, they will dump her and someone with a bit of talent will come to the fore.

      The say David Davis is quite bright (if very hard right wing). So far he has shown little sign of brightness in his total lack of understanding of Brexit, but who knows, maybe Mayhem is holding him back.

      Davidson is no better, although they say that she is the least unpopular of the potential Tory leaders.

      Personally, I thought that he decision to take an honorary Colonelship whilst an acting politician was a bad move.

      At best it makes her look like she thinks she’s a member of the royal family. At worst it is the involvement of the army in party politics. Foolish in either case. A serious potential first or prime minister would have not accepted that role.

      She is lacking in sound judgement, and far too ready to ditch her “principles” for career, as her ever changing attitude to Brexit shows.

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  9. That entrepreneurial MP Doctor Fox,
    Was thinking right outside the box.
    “Lest post-Brexit trade dies,
    We’ll just sell more British Ties.
    That’ll show ’em UK plc really rocks!”

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  10. Ties! Really?
    Don’t fall for this nonsense, it’s a distraction technique.
    Liam Fox is a dangerous ideologue and one with quite sinister links to the US neocon movement.
    The same Liam Fox who set up the fake charity Atlantic Bridge , which was so obviously politically partisan and uncharitable as to to be shut down by the charities commission
    Let’s not mince words, it was a fake charity created by Fox to foster relations between British and American Neocons. Gove was on the council of Atlantic Bridge. With Atlantic Bridge shut down, Gove maintains his links with the Neocons/Tea Partiers via the American Enterprise Institute. ( When you think AEI, think people like Charles Murray in the UK and people like Betsy Devos in the US).

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    1. Oh yes, I agree. Fox is not a harmless idiot. He’s a harmful one.

      He and Werrity… and, as you note, Gove.

      Wasn’t Spud Murphy on that board too?

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  11. Wasn’t there an about turn over the Conservative manifesto? At first they wanted to hunt Foxes and then they didn’t?

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  12. So is Gove wearing his tie tightly around his testes? Is it some kind of Tory kink thing? Is there no limit to their deviance?

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  13. I’m a little unclear here. Mr. Liam Fox is quoted as proclaiming that “MP’s should wear ties,” and then it’s said that “The Speaker, until very recently, would have thrown them out if they didn’t.” Then the subsequent comments leave me further confused about whether or not neckties are or are not required in Commons. For rhetorical purposes of this tongue-in-cheek rant about human civilization, I’ll assume that ties are NO LONGER required.

    (This is all Tris’ fault BTW due to his thought provoking comment: “I’m sure, though, that the Brits invented it long before that. Like BC or something!”)

    First……(sorry, I just can’t resist pointing out funny typos)……..I’m amazed that an obscure King’s (Queen’s?) name like Lois XIII, was popular enough in a dynastic line to require the use of no less than 13 regnal numbers.

    THEN……let us recognize that it is a respect for tradition in matters of public conduct……not least, public attire…….that sets us apart from the Godless savages of Neolithic times. That male politicians should wear ties with their blue suits is surely a MINIMAL requirement for acceptable attire of MP’s at Westminster. Can we ever forget that Betty Boothroyd first eschewed the Speaker’s wig as a sensible accommodation to traditional female hair styles, but then it was a slippery slope to anarchy as we now observe John Bercow, bare headed in the Speaker’s chair, arrogantly flouting centuries of tradition in the Mother of Parliaments.

    Are we now to imply that it’s OK not to wear a simple necktie? What’s next I ask! Will MP’s conduct debates in Commons while attired in swim trunks? Or perhaps in the nude? It’s another slippery slope, as surely as the first British aristocrat in the 1920’s who dressed for dinner in black tie and dinner jacket instead of white tie and tail coat. Dressing for dinner was one of Britain’s greatest contributions to civilization itself, but the coming of the Tuxedo was the beginning of the long downhill slide to “modernism” that is exemplified by the sartorial anarchy that is dinner table attire today.

    Finally, a word of praise for the British royal family. The “Windsor” knot, in its retention of perfect symmetry as it is cinched tightly around the neck, is one of the greatest inventions in the history of man. Politicians would do well to eschew those loosely tied lopsided monstrosities which we see men wearing today…..WHEN they deign to wear a necktie at all. Notice the relative symmetry of the finely attired Mr. Fox’s knot, and compare it with the awkward asymmetry of Mr. Werrity’s knot. If it were skewed any further to his left, the tie would be hidden under his suit jacket.

    In my humble opinion, we can accept centuries of British tradition that lifted western European man out of barbarism, or we can return to the Dark Ages. It’s our choice!

    Sorry that transatlantic time differences runs this up against Soppy Sunday, and that this important essay on the nature of human civilization will never be read by anyone. 😉

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    1. Ah, but it was (read)… By Munguin, no less.

      He favours a scarf, by the way, and eschews this British invention (which he reliably informs me came along at about the same time as Moses was on Mount Ararat).

      To be honest, I’m not sure whether they can get away with not wearing ties in the Commons. I suspect it may have something to do with the mood that Bercow is in. After all, on occasions they are permitted to clap; on occasions they are not.

      Like everything else here, there are no written down rules, so those and such as those please themselves.

      Indeed it was the dear Queen’s father himself, His Late Majesty, who invented the Windsor knot. Rumour has it he first tried it on Noah, around about the time of the beginning of the world (according to the DUP).

      I wholeheartedly concur with that choice you lay out. Erm, was the dark ages before or after Noah and his Ark?

      PS: Nothing about Mr Werrity ever goes to the left. It’s right, right and then a bit more right for him. Or so I’ve heard.

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      1. Tris…..One can never go wrong by following the lead of Mr. Munguin. 😉 As for a scarf, I’m reminded that Fred Astaire….famous for dancing in white tie and tails….didn’t like traditional attire at all. He was often observed in public wearing a brightly colored sash around his trousers instead of a leather belt.

        Why on earth did I assume that the dress code at Westminster was formally specified in writing? Making it up as you go along is SO much more traditionally British. The (sometimes) aversion to expressing approval by clapping your hands together, in favor of slapping your hand on the desk, seems very strange to Americans.

        Kudos to the King for the Windsor knot. As for the chronology of Noah and the Ark and the Dark Ages, I can never keep any of that straight…..what with our own religious nut cases like the DUP…..LOL.

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        1. Apparently, according to Pet Clark, Mr Astaire was always very very elegant. In Finian’s Rainbow, he was obliged to be a bit scruffy, and the director had a terrible job trying to get him to look inelegant.

          Even with a piece of rope round his waist to keep his pants up, he apparently looked a million dollars!

          On the other hand you could put me in a tailored suit, the likes of which David Cameron would wear, and I’d still look like I’d fallen off the back of a lorry!

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      2. I can visualize how elegant and informally stylish Astaire would have looked in a snappy pair of expensive slacks accented with a bright silk sash.

        I would have the same problem with fine tailored suits that you describe. Saves me money of course. I don’t have to spend money on a hopeless quest to look like something I’m not. 🙂

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      3. On the matters concerning neckwear I have a simple guiding principle and that is to never entirely trust a man in a cravat.

        As I understand the former conventional on the wearing of neckties in the House of Commons, which has now been relaxed, I believe that it was less to do with it being compulsory and a member being refused admittance to a sitting of the chamber, more a matter of the member being “invisible” to the Speaker as a consequence of which the member would never be called to speak, raise a point of order or ask a question while improperly dressed.

        Given the royal connections with the windsor knot, i just wonder in passing if the half windsor is reserved for those born on the wrong side of the blanket.

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        1. Ha ha. I don’t think I’ve ever seen a man in a cravat! Well, except David Niven in a film.

          It seems to be an awfully British thing to wear ties…although obviously other people do it too, it seems not to the extent that Brits do.

          I can remember as a young guy going off to Croatia, and being amazed to see bank clerks there in jeans and t shirts… and they were doing a perfectly efficient job of cashing my cheques.

          A few years ago I had neighbours from Hungary. Young students. At one point Dani had an interview for a job to supplement the money he got from his parents back home. He asked me about what to wear, as he understood the culture was different here. As the job was bar and restaurant work in a very posh hotel in St Andrews, I suggested formal wear, black trousers, white shirt and jacket… and of course tie.

          We went to Tesco and bought him the necessary (becasue he didn’t have any). When he was getting ready for his interview he knocked on my door. He wanted to know how to tie a tie. In his 21 year he had never actually worn one.

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  14. Sorry guys, I think ties are stupid. They’re uncomfortable, they don’t keep your neck warm, look silly and are a waste of cloth.

    Ps they’re just another way of helping insecure men feel important and need to go the same way as obligatory high heels for women.

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    1. I’ve always taken the view that people should wear what they feel comfortable in.

      As long as what you are wearing covers your modesty, keeps you warn/cool and is CLEAN (very important), why would it matter?

      Of course, what you wear says a lot about you and your “taste”.

      I laugh when I see the rows of MPs all in blue suits with white shirts and ties. The look like they are art school, in uniform. What that says is that they are all the same, have no imagination and and follow the lead.

      Of course it’s a question of taste. I mean I’m pretty sure none of us wants to see Mr Fox in a cut off t shirt, or Mr Gove in a pair of short shorts.

      Neither (please note Mrs May) do we particularly wish to be treated to your cleavage, and your bondage necklaces on a daily basis.

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    2. PS: Apart from one funeral that I went to a few years ago, I haven’t worn a tie in ten years. (And I wore the tie out of respect for the feelings of the very elderly family of the elderly woman who had died.)

      It’s interesting that you mention the “high heels”. I saw a case recently where a woman took employers to court for insisting on her wearing high heels.

      Also the job centre lost a tribunal when a man claimed was suspended for refusing to wear a tie, because he said the same restriction did not apply to women.

      Now male jobcentre staff are, i think, treated the same way as female staff. They can wear t shirts to work.

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      1. I agree wholeheartedly with your point about being clean and I suppose it’s possible that dress codes evolved from that premis. I remember the director of social work in a council I worked for would routinely ask folk (thinking he was smart no doubt) if theyd forgotten to put their tie on that morning. I was asked 2 or 3 times before he gave up. I think it’s what’s termed, indirect aggression.

        It’s a shame that as a species we get bogged down in all this shit about presentation when it’s ideas, actions and conduct that’s really important. A similar bugbear of mine regards having to change your accent. I never did but I was told it would hold me back because what I said wouldn’t carry as much weight. I don’t know for sure if it actually did because I ascended the greasy pole of success as far as I could stomach.

        It’s very sad how we’ve been so indoctrinated that we can even be prejudiced toward people using our own accent. I think it’s a bit less of a thing among younger people now but it’s still there.

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        1. I agree with all that.

          It how you act not what you wear, that counts. It what you say, not the accent that counts.

          You only have to listen to the House of Commons for that.

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  15. @greig12 and Tris……So I infer that you might consider a simple Tuxedo and black bow tie to be acceptable dinner attire, and no longer require formal white tie, waistcoat, and tail coat? I’m reminded that when the Dowager Duchess of Grantham first saw her son, the current Earl, in a dinner jacket instead of formal wear, she asked him why he didn’t just wear his pajamas to the table and make the sartorial outrage complete. 😉

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    1. Error Correction………That’s the Dowager Countess, not the Dowager Duchess. In Britain as I understand it, the wife of an Earl is a Countess. A British Earl being equivalent to a European Count. So why is she not an “Earless? Just another case of the Brits doing it differently. 🙂

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      1. Danny. In that case, I take back the “grace” bit. I’m not sure how to address a Countess. Munguin rarely has anyone that lowly to dine!!

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