So, Theresa May is to reject Nicola’s timetable for a referendum in Scotland because it might undermine her chaotic mess of a Brexit. Really!!
I imagine that she’s given this a lot of thought and weighed up the consequences… or maybe not.
Still, as you can see, all is OK with the world because Willie is on holiday yet again, and having high jinks with some blondes. Well, nice work if you can get it, Wills, and you can get it if your dad happened to be the Duke of Rothsay, and at least his probably was.
I see that the judges have been forgotten in the Scottish edition, and the SNP are now the enemy of the people. I’m not sure who reads the Daily Mail, although I know that a lot of people do, but I guess they will lap this up with the vinegar that they drink for breakfast to keep them sour enough to get them through another miserable day in the 1950s.
I’m wondering if they have taken into consideration just how many promises were broken in the aftermath of that first referendum, most particularly the one about being thrown out of the EU if we left the UK. I wonder too if they listened to the First Minister’s speech today. Maybe the Scottish accent made it difficult for Daily Mail types in London to understand what she was saying, or maybe they just zoned out and wrote up the story that their readers want to read.
The hate all day has been palpable. All over Twitter we are reading the most ridiculous nonsense about the speech, clearly from people who haven’t heard or read it, or who were too stupid to understand it.
Kezia Dugdale has said that her Twitter feed is full of personal insults, but we know that despite a search of her timeline no one can find any of them. I’ve seen a few corkers about Nicola today, all too rude to put on this family blog.
Realise that the only people who will be impressed by someone calling an opponent a four letter word insult, are people who are already very very firmly on your side. The likelihood of changing anyone’s mind because of that kind of insult is minimal, and probably all in the wrong direction!
We need to win hearts, and mostly minds. We don’t do that by calling the first minister, or the prime minister, a slag. In both cases it is clearly untrue and does no one any credit, or indeed any good.
The SNP are now raising funds for the battle ahead. The campaign was launched this morning and had, the last time I looked, raised £160,000.
Remember that we are up against the English Tories and their wodges of cash. We will need every halfpenny we can get.
*********
I was laughing at the fact that Mrs May told Nicola that politics wasn’t a game… This from the woman that made Boris Johnson Foreign Secretary and put Liam Fox in charge of something more important than buying some teacakes. Sheesh, she’s got some sense of humour, that one.
Talking of Johnson, I’m told he said today that he will vote in favour of a new royal yacht.
All you need to know about the Tories in 9 words. “Sod the NHS, let’s have a new royal yacht”.
MUNGUIN'S NEW REPUBLIC 
Another blow for Sturgeon here….http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4309576/First-Minister-Sturgeon-dons-favourite-outfit-AGAIN.html
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I suspect that the mail, at least in its paper form, is a comic for women. (Online there appears to be a selection of scantily clothed women …and some men… which may broaden the base.)
It’s always good to see some serious in-depth analysis of the political implications of momentous moments in history.
I often used to wonder why David Cameron or George Osborne wore the same blue suit, white shirt, blue tie and black shoes every day to the Commons. Didn’t you?
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His valet was colour blind?
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Well, if he was anything like that woman we paid to get Samantha’s clothes on in the morning, I expect he was indeed.
She always looked like an explosion in a paint factory.
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Oh boy where to start Tris?
First up lets look at the implied” threats” of Mayhem denying US our referendum. Well in my book if she does then she runs foul of the U.N. in my view.
http://www.un.org/en/decolonization/declaration.shtml
Article 2 clearly states:
2. All peoples have the right to self-determination; by virtue of that right they freely determine their political status and freely pursue their economic, social and cultural development.
Come on Mayhem go on be a devil you know you want to BAN our referendum.
Next up we have the RIDICULOUS front page on the Scottish Daily Mail. SNP’s day of betrayal. … REALLY? … betrayal of who exactly? Before we forget there was a quite specific part of the 2016 SNP manifesto that spoke about another independence referendum.
We believe that the Scottish Parliament should have the right to hold another referendum if there is clear and sustained evidence that independence has become the preferred option of a majority of the Scottish people – or if there is a significant and material change in the circumstances that prevailed in 2014, such as Scotland being taken
out of the EU against our will.
This is on page 25 of the manifesto.
https://d3n8a8pro7vhmx.cloudfront.net/thesnp/pages/5540/attachments/original/1461753756/SNP_Manifesto2016-accesible.pdf?1461753756
It is clear therefore that the electorate have not bee betrayed so over to you Daily Mail!
Don’t panic Tris … I’m NOT finished yet.
Thirdly there is another wee zapper for Mayhem to worry about that has conveniently been omitted byt the BBC/SKY etc. Moves appear to be beginning to reunite the whole of Ireland.
BOOM!
There you have it Tris. Mayhem is not going to be fighting one or even two battles on different fronts but by the looks of things it will be THREE battles on THREE different fronts. She barely has the staff to fight ONE battle how is she gonna cope with THREE? LOL
As I pointed out to wee Kez earlier on Monday she has no concept of what being abused is all about. Someone had been through the previous TWELVE HOURS on her twitter line and found absolutely NO abuse. I suggested to her she should take a look at some REAL abuse before starting her nonsense.
As far as Johnson and his wee floaty boaty thingy is concerned let him have it WE aint paying for it and they’ll have to go to a FOREIGN shipyard to get the thing built. I wonder how many Billions this will cost?
Just wait till the general populus darnb surf hear about this little plan and there is STILL an NHS crisis, Education crisis, Social care crisis, police and law and order crisis.
rant over. LOL
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LOL. First of all, I’m so sorry your comment fell foul of WordPress. So did BLP’s.
I’ve no idea why. It just happens form time to time.
Secondly, are you a lawyer?
You certainly seem to know your law.
You’re bang on. She can’t stop a referendum if we want to have one. She can ignore its results at her peril. But Britain doesn’t care what the UN think about it. Note that they have been censured on human rights because of that they are doing to disabled people. Britain is more important than the UN.
She sure does have problems on all fronts. EU, Scotland and Ireland. not to mention the fact that her own party is split. And that public services in England are getting worse by the day.
And still they will do up Buck House. And still they will do up Westminster. And still they want to build a royal yacht and bring back the days of the Raj.
Delusional.
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I’d love to say I’m a lawyer Tris but if I did I’d be dragged up in front of the Bar or somewhere on a charge of impersonating a Lawyer. LOL
I think just calling them delusional is letting them off on the cheap. They are more like xenophobic greed driven ignorant disrespectful self centred nauseating maggots.
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Nothing like being dragged to the bar, Arbroath. Mine’s a pint.
Erm, and why don’t you say what you REALLY think… On reflection, no, best not to.
🙂
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My UN experience as a translator (treaties in peculiar European languages a specialty) says Arbroath1320 is correct, and although I’m not an international lawyer, I know quite a few, and it’s amazing what you can find out from people if you ask them the right questions.
So, going back another 15 years before the Declaration on the Granting of Independence to Colonial Countries and Peoples (that’s the one Arbroath1320 referenced) was signed in December 1960, all the way back to 26 June 1945, i.e., right back to the signing of the very Charter of the United Nations which is the UN’s founding document, the principle of national self-determination was held to be so important that it is set forth in article 1 of the Charter’s operative part. Here it is:
“Article 1
The Purposes of the United Nations are:
…
2. To develop friendly relations among nations based on respect for the principle of equal rights and self-determination of peoples, and to take other appropriate measures to strengthen universal peace;
…”
The new independence referendum just announced by the First Minister must be seen as giving effect to that right of self-determination of peoples, and it is an inalienable one. A corollary of the fact that it is inalienable is that it would necessarily be UNLAWFUL under international law for Westminster to attempt to deny us its “permission” to hold it.
The current Westminster regime, however, is notorious in its contempt for people’s fundamental rights of all kinds, as shown, for example, by its actions against the rights of disabled people under the Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities and its Optional Protocol, which the UK signed up to immediately they were both opened for signature, on 30 March 2007. Regrettably, and worryingly, the current regime at Westminster represents, to my mind at least, the very same mindset – in embryo still, perhaps – that gave us WWII in the first place.
That said, let me quote the very first part of the preamble to the Charter, right at its very beginning, so you can see exactly what it says about human rights, national rights, and treaty obligations.
“WE THE PEOPLES OF THE UNITED NATIONS DETERMINED
– to save succeeding generations from the scourge of war, which twice in our lifetime has brought untold sorrow to mankind, and
– to reaffirm faith in fundamental human rights, in the dignity and worth of the human person, in the equal rights of men and women and of nations large and small, and
– to establish conditions under which justice and respect for the obligations arising from treaties and other sources of international law can be maintained, and
– to promote social progress and better standards of life in larger freedom,
…”.
I have every reason to believe that we Scots, as a society, would back all of that by a very strong majority, even greater than 62:38. The British Government which signed up to the Charter and made the UK a founding member of the United Nations back in 1945, supported it too, obviously.
In other words, of the UK Government in 1945, Scotland in 1945 (I believe that’s a safe assumption), Scotland in 2017, and the May regime of 2017, the one exception is – answers on a postcard please.
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Thanks for that clarification.
He he. It’s good to have experts around (but don’t tell Wee Govey, will you!)
It will be interesting to see what May does. As we’ve said, it’s not really a question of getting permission. We all know she has to do that, or be in breach of the treaty you mentioned.
Cameron agreed to everything at the Edinburgh summit. The only thing he demanded was that the question of Devo Plus be excluded.
Ironically, he later offered Devo Plus to win, when he looked certain to lose…and then went back on his word.
That’s Eton boys for you.
Anyway, let’s see what May comes up with.
It would be interesting to hear more about what sounds like a fascinating career. Odd languages really interest me.
Maybe you’ll do a guest post one day?
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The Mail is a very, ahem, odd newspaper.
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Very.
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The paper of choice for the Brittunculi.
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LOL LOL Yes.
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Anybody else think that SLabber and all the other Yoon Holyrood mob have been taken over by giant alien lizards, who seem not to understand democracy and the choice of the people.
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I had wondered about that. I just think that Brits have always talked loudly about democracy while ensuring that it only existed in a rather spurious manner.
Royals, Aristos, Privy Counsels, FPTP…
And it will get worse. Stuff taken back from the EU may be reserved for government rather than parliament.
The Tories have seen their chance and they want to profit to the max.
Sorry about you comment needing approval. Damned if I understand why. Arbroath’s too!
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I only see these newspaper headlines on OUR websites. I understand the printed copy of the Daily Fail sells about 90,000 copies. If they are in fact “sold”. The Express is worse. 44k copies “sold”. We are never going to get a good press from either of them. You know what? I could not care less. They are like screaming weans, only malicious. And their websites are cut price versions of Hello magazine – gossip about those who are legends in their own minds ( copyright Dirty Harry ).
Newspapers are purchased by people who already agree with their editorial line We have some people in Scotland who hate the SNP, adore the Royal Parasites and long for the restoration of the Raj. They are not our target market. Write them off. Anyone who thinks like that is not going to be happy until Britannia rules the waves.
We accord importance to minnows in this debate by even giving a damn about Express or Mail headlines. The Ministry Of Truth is the only old media which matters. And even they are discredited in so many eyes now that their barbs are blunted. I used to listen daily to Call Kaye. Now if I inadvertently hear her voice even I am surprised with the reflex reaction I can manage as I change channel. 5000 people I read maybe listen to her now? Don’t you think Tokyo Kaye and Union Jackie and all the other Haw Haws know their careers are over in Scotland when we vote Yes? Its existential for them too.
Now lets get organised. The band is reforming. Lets make this the ultimate farewell tour. And bring home our independence.
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Yes. I don’t take the headlines very seriously, except to mock the editorial staff of the papers. It must be very embarrassing to admit you work for one of these comics.
Meanwhile, Munguin is sorting out his Yes badges and getting ready for leafletting.
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When Bungalow Bill gets back from his frolicking he and Katy will no doubt be instructed to plan for another tax burden to take peoples’ minds off the reality of the current situation. Only problem is, this time it won’t work.
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No, the only people who are taken in by that sort of thing are those who are already taken in by the benefits of the broad shoulders of the UK.
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I suppose they’ll have to ask for volunteers again then.
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Oh yes. Every man woman and dog’s shoulder to the wheel.
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The hate and bile being directed at Scotland by some people in England and HM press,surely reinforces the idea that England is not a fit country to be in “union” with anyone.
It is either their way or the highway.
The EU will be glad to see the back of them and will have great sympathy for Scotland having to suffer the continuing abuse and complete lack of respect.
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Unfortunately for the UK, it’s not really a popular country.
Maybe this whole thing could have been avoided if Cameron hadn’t marched over the Brussels demanding this and that, and had instead taken the “listen, help us out here, guys” attitude.
May, of course, has the tact of a bulldozer and it seems that she is unpopular in Europe. No wonder she thought Bojo would make a good foreign secretary.
On the other hand, Nicola is popular, and so is Scotland. We want them and they want us.
I feel really sorry for friends in England being led by such a set of goons. And you can say that that is what they voted for, but, in fact, they didn’t. Well under 50% of English voters wanted the Tories and only 52%, a relatively narrow margin, wanted Brexit. So we can’t even say that they deserve what they are going through.
I suspect that very few of them want hard Brexit. But she is determined to do it.
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Nice to know we’re a family Tris, occasional commentators included I hope.
Nicola played a blinder yesterday, the swivel eyed, froth flecked reaction in the msm and broadcasting was a sight to behold.
May was downgraded to second fiddle, while Nicola became the Prima ballerina on the world stage. Scotland once again front and centre.
The EU of course are laughing all the way to the negotiating table, Mays bargaining chips having been seriously reduced, delaying the A 50 announcement must have been a serious embarrassment.
If the establishment learned anything from the first indyref, its not yet apparent, they certainly haven’t learned anything about the people of Scotland.
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I’ve always liked to think of us as family. Even ones that disagree with Munguin’s take on things.
I was so proud of Nicola yesterday. It was a brilliant speech. As I read it through I was looking for things that could be torn down, bu I couldn’t see any.
She laid it out logically.
Anyone who accuses her to rush into it, or going for what she wanted all along must appreciate the huge amount of work that went into producing the work that she has on compromise.
I’d love to know what the people in Brussels think.
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There was a “meeting” of a Yes group in Nairn last night. I tell you, it was a very happy gathering!
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I bet it was.
Why, Munguin even invited yours truly to enjoy a small (very small) toast to our success.
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The guns of HMS British Establishment are once again being brought to bear on oor wee country. This will, courtesy of the MSM, give every knuckle dragging baw bag carte blanche to vent the frustrations of their sad and shitty lives upon us.
Bring it on, we’ve got to win this time because failure is too painful to comprehend. It’s time for every Yesser who can string a coherent argument together to get involved. If that’s not your strength then there will be other things need doing.
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Agreed Dave. Losing this time will put Scotland in a wee box and send a message to the rest of Europe that we weren’t worth all that faith they had in us.
Not to mention confining us to a world of permanent Tory misery for the next 20 years.
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Worth reiterating Nicola’s comment ‘re section 30. At no point did Nicola say that she was going to ask permission to hold a referendum. In referring to it, she said, she would seek authority from the Scottish Parliament to agree terms with the UK gov on section 30. Different ball game altogether.
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Yes. That’s true. We don’t ask permission. We negotiate the terms. May will try to make sure that she has completed her Brexit by the time we have our referendum. In which case we will have to join, rather than continue to be in, the EU.
But everything she does in her petty nastiness, will count against her.
She’s a petty vindictive woman, the sacking of Heseltine showed that. We probably ain’t seen nothing yet, but she is also a very incompetent person. She has a habit of doing stuff and looking at the consequences later. And I reckon she is badly advised by sycophants.
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Even though only the editor’s grannie might actually buy the lying rags, there are real problems with the unionist press. The first is that the BBC runs “What the papers say” features several times a day, thus giving currency to their malicious partisan lies. The second is that the banner headlines are on display in all paper shops, supermarkets, railway and bus stations, airports and filling stations. This provides a shed load of subliminal messages.
It also gives the BBC support in setting the agenda, with our side being forced onto the defensive by being repeatedly bombarded with detailed questions, usually containing baseless assertions that have been debunked again and again.
This is where we will need a simple, clear message, and keep ramming it home on every possible occasion, and in every available outlet. Scotland can make a better job of running Scotland than Westminster can. God knows, we couldn’t do worse.
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That’s true Fergus. It’s a constant drip drip drip of SNP BAD, Scotland BAD, UK Good.
It could wear down some of the undecided.
So we need to keep getting the truth out there.
That’s why I’m glad Wings has been well funded thins year.
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Tris
While I think we all understand the hate is coming our way even I was surprised it only took about 3 seconds for it to start, you would have thought they would have waited until the first poll showing a narrow no or yes lead before they started. I also see the Daily Diana has gotten the dogs out early, never ones to let the truth get in the way they are starting with the aggression early. We should arrange some fake meetings in George Square to encourage the Hitler Youth from the day after the referendum to show up in their Hitler t-shits and start their Theresa May salutes early, if anything it will put the media in a difficult spot right away. Kezia Dugdale has no idea what abuse is, the rudest things I have seen from the YES side have tended to be comments from the Rev lol but the stuff from the yoons is hate filled and horrible, most of it probably against the law. Maybe that was why Kelly wanted the obscene communication bill stopped in it’s tracks at Holyrood but either way this one is going to be a corker and I would not put it past the yoons to get violent, they do seem a tad bit angry and a bill hasn’t even been to Holyrood yet, I will hope for the best but sadly will fear the worst. As I hope to actually campaign physically this time maybe I better take out dental insurance :).
Bruce
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My advice is not to go out on your own. Always in groups. and with your phone ready to film any anti-social or violent behaviour.
Sad by we are up against people like the Hitler youth and their Nazi salutes. We know what they do to people who get in their way. Ask the family of that Polish lad in England.
Of course many unionists are not like that. But there are some really dangerous people. Look at the tweets that Arbroath loaded.
Kezia really is full of it. She’s not NOTHING. Nicola has had death threats.
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well I’m ready to stuff envelopes, (wo)man stalls etc. One thing I won’t be doing is wasting too much time on the guardian website or indeed any other (bar MR of course). Shit just got real. The consequences of a No vote don’t bear thinking about. We are talking about the very existence of Scotland as a country rather than a part of Greater England which is looking a very dystopian nightmare in the future.
Saor Alba indeed.
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Yepp, I’m up for stuffing envelopes and delivering stuff… as I said, in groups. Dundee’s a pretty safe place to be for independence, but there are thugs here too.
OK, let’s do this.
I’m sorry you got caught up in the WordPress nightmare again PP. Nothing to do with me. BLP did too.
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tris and the rest of the YES lot
There are many many things on which I totally agree with on the
left not the right of the snp . But its the solution to them which I find
flawed the nation state to me is dead and should remain so we should
all dance happily on its grave
.”All state frontiers are only fetters upon the productive forces. The task of the proletariat is not to preserve the status quo, i.e., to perpetuate the frontiers, but on the contrary to work for their revolutionary elimination with the aim of creating the Socialist United States of Europe and of the entire world.” (Trotsky, Writings 1935-36.)
Last time I fully expected YES to win and was shocked as any nat at the result
this time i will sit on me hands and feet taking no part..
Que Sera, Sera
The English torys are the most disgusting vile political force since
the blackshirts in the 1930s they have taken the ideology of the BNP
UKIP and the National Front and made it main stream.
As the NAZI supporting daily mail shows ever day in every edition.
Their aim is to destroy the NHS and any public organisation in order to
allow their supporters to feast on the public purse thorough the corruption
of privatisation.
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Unfortunately we are living in a world full of nation states Niko, and the UK government wants to cut loose from the EU and create borders where there were none before. So, who do you think Leon would have backed, the SNP or the Tories?
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Excellent question…
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conan
er ! no we are living/existing in a world subdued by a capitalist elite
Leon says there is no difference between the snp and the Torys thats
from me Ouija board
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Is that the ghost of Margaret Thatcher talking to you. (You’ll know because it will talk down to you in a condescending way…very slowly like you won’t understand otherwise.
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Karl and Vladimir think you’re talking shite Niko. Joe sends his regards.
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They’re probably right…
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If we don’t get out they will drag us with them. Unfettered by the EU and Human Rights, and encouraged by Trump (or if he’s impeached, then his VP Pense) we will have no rights, no welfare state and no NHS.
We would have won last time, I think, if Cameron hadn’t lied about what would happen.
The ships aren’t being built; the forces are leaving (except the dangerous nukes)
The civil service jobs have gone south.
They lied about everything…and the EU too…
And they spend money on the royals and crossrail and HS2… and we get less what what it costs to repair Buckingham Palace.
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Watched Piers Morgan the misogynist vs Alex Samond of the two year Generation
via the Herald seems to me Piers main gribe wuz Nicola hasnt arranged things so May
can beat her easily …….Not playing the game how the English toffs would prefer
the bounder
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I posted this on WOS earlier and i do hope that the reps can do better , for ALL our sakes
twathater says:
14 March, 2017 at 5:21 pm
AN OPEN LETTER TO NICOLA STURGEON
Nicola I watched daily politics today and was utterly appalled at Tommy Shepard , if this is going to be the level of disputation put forward by our (SNP SG MPS and MSPS ) we would be as well not bothering with a referendum .
Tommy allowed 2 very incompetent MSPS to SPOUT DELIBERATE LIES , spurious MISINFORMATION and outright scaremongering , without in any meaningful way challenging them , some on the site are trying to deflect blame on to the interviewer but I am sorry to say the blame lies squarely with Mr Shepard .
On watching the programme I was convinced that Mr Shepard was not even in the room .
Too many SNP persons participating in the broadcast media are simply not good enough at it , they are time and time again being caught wrong footed or simply don’t have answers to challenges, they are constantly reacting rather than challenging, this is the wrong methodology ,you are allowing dubious and deliberate lies and obfuscation to register in people’s subconscious whilst your responses are frequently interrupted and talked over,not allowing the answer oxygen .
Let us not forget the establishment drones are experts at this, they have centuries of disabling peoples ideas and dreams
The Scottish people NEED convincing through proper facts spoken coherently and with conviction , that Scotland can survive and prosper,and make their OWN decisions on their and their childrens future, without being dragged along reluctantly with decisions made by their neighbours.
I desperately want my country to be independent, to forge it’s own future , to make its own way in the world and to make its own decisions ,to decide how we raise our finances and how and who we spend them on ,to trade with who WE want ,to ensure that every citizen has a future without deprivation and homelessness , to utilise our resplendent resources for our citizens not for the benefit of pirates.
I want ALL of these things, but unless the SNP SG step up and take the fight to the establishment and their unionist lackeys,fight fire with fire ,proact rather than react then we will all face 2014 disappointment again
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I can’t comment as I haven’t seen it, but maybe other people have.
I certainly agree that we need out best people up there in front. I’ve always ranked Tommy. I’m surprised that he did badly.
Any comments from people who saw it?
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“Hands off our Brexit” is a very odd headline. Are the Daily Mail really taking ownership of Brexit? I thought it was the will of the people.
Only 1 day in to this and already the lies are building up about the Euro, Scotland’s theoretical “deficit”, Spanish vetos, Schengen, EU membership queues.
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Corker, hmmm?
The point is, Daily Mail, we don’t want your Brexit. You can have it. Keep it… It’s yours.
All yours. And may you be really happy together.
It;’s going to be a wearing 18 months or so. Being hit be this nonsense every day.
i don;t mind yer average Joe saying we’ll have to join the € and be in Schengen, join the queue behind Cote D’Ivoire, and owe all of the UK debt.
But we’re getting it from politicians and journalists.
How they must fear us if they have to make up their arguments..
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There is a petition – yes I know, another one – for the puir sowels that are shiting it as we speak.
http://petitionmap.unboxedconsulting.com/?petition=180642
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Aw bless. I seem to have lost me signing pen.
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